She's Got The Shakes !!!

My 94 RRC LWB Has had a bad case of the shakes since I got it. It usually only happens above 45MPH and on bumpy roads.
It was real bad around corners. Some vibe may be wheel balance. I noticed some crud on the inside of the rims.
So far, I have replaced Panhard Rod Bushings,Track Rod, Track Rod Adjuster, 4 Tie-Rod Ends, Steering Damper, F/R Sway Bar Ball Joints And Bushings.
I took it out for a test drive tonight and it only did it once at about 75MPH on a bumpy curve out on the Interstate, but it recovered quickly without having to slow down.
It seems to be better, but not quite solid yet. I have Blisten shocks and Blue Coils from an EAS conversion kit in right now.
Next I am going to replace the Front Blisten Shocks with new OEM Shocks and replace the rest of the Suspension Bushings as well as the Rear Shock Bushings.
I have the Complete Standard Black Bushing Kit from Atlantic British for $149.
If it still persists after that; do I need to adjust the steering gear box?
I have located the lock nut and set screw. Looks like a fun one to get loose.
Any tips on how to break that nut loose would be appreciated.

Found a great way to get that rear A-Arm Ball Joint to pop.
After beating on it for a couple hours; I just put the casteling nut on flush for the test drive and when I pulled back in to the drive way it rocked a bit and broke loose.

Stop right now! you need to adjust your swivel ball pre-load.

Um... no and yes.
No, I can't stop at this point. She's got 170,000 miles on her OE parts and I'm replacing everything including a swivel ball tune-up.
Yes, I have heard that the swivel ball pre-load may be a part of the issue.
I have also read the panhard rod bushings or steering damper will cause this when they get bad and allow for lateral movement or that the steering gear box may need to be adjusted to take out the play.
It only occurs at higher speed and when set off by a big bump and is worse if it happens on a corner.
I had a passenger look out the window one time and he said that the axle was moving left to right and not up and down.
This lead me to replace all the bushings. The clanging metal was the indicator for the tie-rods and ball joints.
I figured that the pistons on the shocks must be toast if they have been vibing sideways like that for who knows how long before i got it.
I have the rear suspension and the front radius arms out right now to get the bushings pressed.
When they return I will finish the shocks and do the rear brakes.
I plan on ordering wheel bearing kits and swivel ball kits on the next round of parts when I get the spare cash.

If it still shakes after all that; it would have to be gear mesh on the steering right?

MP37, Swivel ball preload and tires will correct the issue.

Every other part has either fallen off or had to be broken off.
I have 3 different sets of rims and new tires for this ride (16"/16"/18") so I really don't think the tires are the issue.
Again, I'm still working on a complete rebuild of the entire suspension..
I just have 4 more bushings and I will be done with that nightmare!
I will then take it in and get it alligned. Last time they couldn't do anything with it because the tie-rod ends on the track rod were ceased.
I ended up twisting one clean off trying to get it out. All of the ball joints and tie rod ends were just a few miles from dropping out.
Thanks for the ideas. Let me get it back together and do the back brakes... then I can check the Swivels.
I will let you know what I come up with.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bait

MP37, Swivel ball preload and tires will correct the issue.

I finally have all of the suspension renewed except the shocks.
To it for a 10 minute test drive.
Rides like a dream except the shake still happened on a big pot hole.
Now it's more voilent and really kicks the steering wheel.
Sounds and feels like something has play(possibly in the steering gear mesh).
Only reason I'm concerned with mesh is because of the lateral beating it's been taking.
So we now are truely down to the swivel balls and PSGB.

Any idea what it would cost to have the swivel balls and wheel bearings restored at the dealer?

MP37, I understand your concerns. I had the same many moons ago. It does not seem logical but, preload is the answer! If you are mechanically inclined, I can walk you thru it...

LWB's rule!

I have the OE manual and have looked at the procedurein section 54.
They show it as part of a complete teardown.
I don't have a problem with the mechanical end of it.
It just looks time consuming.
I have seriously spent more time under this vehicle than driving it since April!

What is the time estimate for your approach?
What parts do I need?

O.K.
Talked to the dealer and they say about $600 for the adjustment and probably another $500 for wheel bearings.
So to do this right myself what do I need...

Light duty spring scale
2 top swivel pin kits with seals, shims and bearing.
2 wheel bearing rebuild kits.
Torque wrench.
Anything else?

MP, this is the short cut method that the Dealer will use and it works! Acquire a fishing scale from a local source. Remove front wheels and all tie rods connected to the hub. The hubs will likely flop back and forth. Remove the top two bolts on the hub assembly. Remove the top swivel pin and the shims. Start by removing a shim equal to a business card. Replace the bolts and tighten. Connect the scale to the tie rod socket, pull and watch for a 16-18 inch pound reading after initial break off. You will leak some oil or grease from the swivel.

Far from complete but a start...

Nice! I was hoping there was an easier way than shown in the manual. It looked like you could do it while assembled, but they show it at the end of the axle rebuild process before re-assembly. Planned on restoring the swivel assemblies yet this summer. Just don't have the time for a complete teardown right now.
Just need to get it stable so I can do the shocks and get it alligned again. I will rotate tires have them balanced again when in for another alignment.
I paid $90 for unlimited alignments for the next 3 years on her so that's covered!
Thanks for the condensed version of the repair process and the conversions to inch pounds(manual shows nM).
I'll owe you one after this.

This is not the ' manual ' procedure, it's a field procedure. Have your swivel balls been converted to grease? If they have, they should have stickers under the hood stating such. You will need to replenish the grease lost by this ' Field ' procedure. Half a tube of one shot per side.

Yup. I don't see the need to strip it just to adjust the top pin a bit. I don't think it has been converted to grease. DS swivel ball seal leaks a little but never leaves a drip on anything. I know this is a temporary fix, but if it takes the "slack" out I'll be a happy camper. A summary of what I read. Note: the numbers below are with swivel ball seal and the axle removed. Attach a spring scale to ball joint bore and pull... resistance should be 1.16 to 1.46 kg. Adjust by removing or adding shims to top swivel pin. When correct apply Loctite, tighten to 78 Nm, and bend lock tabs.Substitute in your numbers and Bingo. And ya, it's kinda like changing a u-joint with a rock and a socket a million miles from nowhere. It may no be the "right" way to do it, but if it works...
I'll get it done here in the next couple days and report back.

O.K finally got to it.
It all went pretty smooth. About 45 minutes a side.
The drivers side had 5 shims on it and I removed the thickest one to get is to test right.
The passenger side only had two shims. It had a thick one and one razor thin one. I removed the thick one and this side will only hold to about 10 inch pounds.
Should I remove the other shim or do I need to do some thing different?

I took it out for a spin and it feels tighter. It only shook a little on and old bridge on the roughest highway I could find, but it recovered instantly.
This fix should get me by until I commit to the final drive assembly re-build. It won't see speeds over 50 MPH for a while.
I still have the shocks and radius arm bushings to do so I will carry on.

quote:

ORIGINAL: moneypit37

O.K finally got to it.
It all went pretty smooth. About 45 minutes a side.
The drivers side had 5 shims on it and I removed the thickest one to get is to test right.
The passenger side only had two shims. It had a thick one and one razor thin one. I removed the thick one and this side will only hold to about 10 inch pounds.
Should I remove the other shim or do I need to do some thing different?

I took it out for a spin and it feels tighter. It only shook a little on and old bridge on the roughest highway I could find, but it recovered instantly.
This fix should get me by until I commit to the final drive assembly re-build. It won't see speeds over 50 MPH for a while.
I still have the shocks and radius arm bushings to do so I will carry on.

MP37, it is very critical that you get both swivel balls to drag 16-18 in/LBs. If you can not acquire this reading you may have internal swivel ball problems. Front tires and swivel ball preload will give you the shakes.

So...
I went back into the passenger side and chipped around a little and a couple more shims were found and removed.
I finally got it to hold between 15-18 "lbs. I rotated tires again and took it for a drive.
It's finally consistent on tension while turning both ways and the shakes are gone.
Now for the tires. The tires on it right now are Uniroyal Loredo's. I noticed today that 3 are "Nail Guard" tires and one is not. After rotating these all the way around the vehicle a couple times and having the non-NG end up on the drivers front today; I noticed that the non-"Nail Guard" tire is the softest and best riding tire out of the bunch. I know the nail guard tires are about the worst thing you can put on a smooth riding vehicle. I'm thinking of getting a matching non-NG to put on the passenger side front.
After this year these will be used only for winter tires. I am just trying to get this front end straightened out before I throw on my 18"s. The 16"s are cheap, but the Toyo's on the 18"s are about $245 each so I don't want to mount them on a loose front end.
I'll go back to the shocks, radius arm bushings and another allignment and have a new tire mounted on that passenger side and let see what happens.
Thanks again for your patience, I have built many a 4x4, but none the likes of this!

quote:

ORIGINAL: moneypit37

So...
I went back into the passenger side and chipped around a little and a couple more shims were found and removed.
I finally got it to hold between 15-18 "lbs. I rotated tires again and took it for a drive.
It's finally consistent on tension while turning both ways and the shakes are gone.

Congrads! Shakes are gone!!!

It getting better all the time.
Took it in today and had 2 new tires put on the front and another allignment. It drives and rides great. There is still a little clunk in the front, but I'm hoping that will be cured when I get the new shocks in and those radius arm bushings done. I have 2 new cat's on the way so I will take the exhaust and the arms to the machine shop at the same time.
She has come a long way in the last 4 months. The wife is impressed; she drove it once or twice in April when I first got it and again today. She says it feels like a new car compared to they way it drove when I took posession.
A pile of parts, a case of degreaser, about 100 hours of labor and a few helpful tips from the friendly net-neighborhood rover guys and I now have a 100% complete, 100% original(minus the air susp), 100% functional 1994 RRC LWB that is 1 of 5500ish imported into the U.S. and may very well be one of the cleanest left... to me this is truely priceless.