While I'm having the Head Gaskets replaced...
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While I'm having the Head Gaskets replaced... - 10/26/2007 11:24:42 PM
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Donald
Posts: 8
Joined: 10/23/2007
Status: offline
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Hello to All; I have a '96 Discovery SD, 178,250 miles on it. Just replaced a water pump three weeks ago (the orginal water pump I believe...)!The (independent), shop told me that I really need to replace the head gaskets, timing chain cover gasket, as well as the intake manifold gasket!
My question: while the heads are off, would one/does one remove the 'carbon build-up' (wire wheel on a Dremel...), I don't know how its done, or if it should be done (maybe a valve job), should be done at this time?!?
And, I was also told that the pan gasket should be replaced. Again, while the pan is off, should I 'break-out' my "putty -knife" and remove all of the sludge that I know is sitting on the bottom of the oil pan!
My "beast" and this independent shop are 'working' with me and my fluctuating (monthly) budget, on different "phases" of getting this truck into shape (I really want to keep it going while I finish my college endeavor...), about another " light-year" to go!!!
Donald
"...its not what you drive...its what DRIVES you!!!
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RE: While I'm having the Head Gaskets replaced... - 10/27/2007 7:51:07 AM
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Disco Mike
Posts: 10490
Joined: 4/27/2006
Status: offline
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First do an ATF flush to get as much gum build up out of the engine. Certainly remove any old gasket material and clean out the oil pan as well as the crank are with carb or brake cleaner.
With your mileage, your heads should be sent to a machine shop and completely gone thu, you should be needing a valve job.
Make sure your eplace your old plug wires with a set of Magnacor 8mm wires also replae all hoses and belts.
Good luck.
_____________________________
Mike
Retired service manager. Member of the Solihull Society, NCLR club,past member of the SCLR club and Santa Barbara 4 Wheelers.
99 D2, 3" lift, lockers, H.D. axles, 4:11 gears, Custom front and rear bumpers, Warn winch, HID lights and an Engel 45.
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RE: While I'm having the Head Gaskets replaced... - 10/27/2007 8:12:38 PM
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Donald
Posts: 8
Joined: 10/23/2007
Status: offline
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Hello Disco Mike; Hey thanks for the reply, and your input! I did have a compression test performed at the time the water pump was replaced. All 8 cylinders were in the range of: 114-130 . And all hoses (upper/lower, and heater hoses), thermostat, and the serpentine (did I spell that right?!?), belt were replace at that time, as well.
What will the ATF flush do to the bearings? Or is that not of concern?!?
Thanks for your time...Donald
< Message edited by Donald -- 10/27/2007 8:15:29 PM >
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RE: While I'm having the Head Gaskets replaced... - 10/28/2007 7:27:29 AM
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Disco Mike
Posts: 10490
Joined: 4/27/2006
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ATF has been used y by dealers for 20 plus years to flush alot of gunk for an old engine, there is no harm to the engine or it bearings. Think about a tranny and all the internal pressure on those bearings.
Drain the crank case and refill with 6 quarts of ATF, let it idle only for 20 minutes then start stripping down the engine, it will be alot cleaner on the inside.
By the way with that low of a compression, I would look closely at the valves, I would rather see those numbers in the 150 lus range.
Take care
_____________________________
Mike
Retired service manager. Member of the Solihull Society, NCLR club,past member of the SCLR club and Santa Barbara 4 Wheelers.
99 D2, 3" lift, lockers, H.D. axles, 4:11 gears, Custom front and rear bumpers, Warn winch, HID lights and an Engel 45.
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RE: While I'm having the Head Gaskets replaced... - 11/6/2007 10:31:05 PM
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Donald
Posts: 8
Joined: 10/23/2007
Status: offline
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Hello Disco Mike; I receive a phone call the other day from the shop that repaired/replaced my water pump. They told me that there was never a compression test performed on my 1996 Land Rover Disco, and the 'numbers' that I was told (never written down or 'logged' on an invoice), do NOT apply to my particular vehicle! After looking over my invoice, very carefully, there was no indication that a compression test was performed, and I was not charged for it!
So, here is what I have done lately. I found the Sea Foam Additive and installed a can of it in my gas tank, and then added 20 gallons of Prem. gas (and then needed to take out a re-fi on my home...), I will let you know what I think of this product, or just what it has done for me and my truck. As for my next 'move' on my truck and the shop (they offered me a reasonable discount or 'service' at their cost).
Anyway, I think I will go ahead with an "official" compression test & the ATF 'flush' (or let the shop do it), and then get the head gaskets replaced. I am going to ask the shop if they think that I should remove the oil pan and clean-out all of the sludge (I know that is is half-full)!
Thats where I stand right now. More/Later...Donald
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O.K, here's waht I've done or had done! - 12/1/2007 9:08:16 PM
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Donald
Posts: 8
Joined: 10/23/2007
Status: offline
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O.K, so here's what I've done, or had done since I've last talked to you all. On the 21St of Nov. I picked up my 1996 Land Rover Discovery SD (with 178,250 miles), at my local independent repair shop.
I had a value job performed and replaced the head gaskets, as well as the valve cover gaskets, timing cover gasket, the pan gasket. I was shocked to see how bad the oil and sludge had 'baked-on' the underside of the valve covers. And, in the oil pan, it was just as bad. They "hot-tanked" most of the parts that were able to be removed from my engine, and a 'technician' (who is in a intern position, at the shop), spent the next three days using solvent and a few scrapers, wire wheels, and whatever it took to clean-up the rest of the block/engine that was waiting for my heads to return from the machine shop.
Everything went back together well, and they performed a compression test, and all cylinders were well within specs. I could not believe just clean everything was after they finished!
They told me that the K&N Air Filter that I was using on my truck had taken out my mass air flow sensor (I wonder if the 12yrs. and 178,250 miles on the truck would also have a lot to do with the mass air flow sensor no longer "up-to-par")! They (the shop), suggested an 'aftermarket' type mass air flow sensor. I was willing mainly because it was $400.00, instead of $675.00 to $788.00!
I paid the bill...over $3,300.00, and went out to start my truck...it would NOT start...One of the other mechanics came out and helped me get it started. I drove it down to the first gasoline station I found and filled it up with premium fuel. I had a 'heck-of-a-time' getting it started at the gas station!?!
For the next two days I was really having a problem everytime I would shut it off it would not want to restart (it would idle down so low, and then die at a stop light)!
I went back to the repair shop and they applied a fuel pressure test, but that turned out O.K.! And then they swapped-out the mass air flow sensor for a 'known' working one. The "beast" came alive!!! It idled really well, run great and did NOT die at intersections! Problem solved...The shop called me and told me that they had put a "loaner" mass air flow sensor, and I need to come back in and tell them just how everything was working, and they would have a genuine Land Rover Mass Air Flow Sensor (and charge me accordingly)!
I'm still having a problem with there comments regarding just how the K&N Air Filter "took-out" my mass air flow sensor! I called K&N Filter Corp. and they told me that they wanted my 'old' mass air flow sensor, and they would call the repair shop.
I'll let you all know just how theis 'plays-out' when K&N Corp. gets back to me!
More/Later...Donald
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RE: O.K, here's waht I've done or had done! - 12/2/2007 6:50:26 AM
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Disco Mike
Posts: 10490
Joined: 4/27/2006
Status: offline
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Stay in touch Don, I am curious how it all turns out.
_____________________________
Mike
Retired service manager. Member of the Solihull Society, NCLR club,past member of the SCLR club and Santa Barbara 4 Wheelers.
99 D2, 3" lift, lockers, H.D. axles, 4:11 gears, Custom front and rear bumpers, Warn winch, HID lights and an Engel 45.
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RE: O.K, here's waht I've done or had done! - 2/14/2008 11:03:15 PM
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Donald
Posts: 8
Joined: 10/23/2007
Status: offline
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Hello Mike; well, its been two months and 3,300 miles since I had the valve-job.
On Monday, the 11Th of Feb., 2008 I started smelling a faint smokey smell, I heard
a loud noise, from under the hood, and the tach and the power steering shut-down!
I "coasted" into a cul-d-sac (residental area), and popped the hood. The serpentine
belt was off all of the pulleys, but still in good shape. There was power steering fluid
all over the engine. And the belt tensioner was 'bent'.
I had it towed over to my 'favorite' "Independent Land Rover Specialists."
They had a used tensioner assembly (GEMS Motor), for $100.00.
I also needed an Exterior Driver's Door Handle. And they had a used one for $80.00.
A supply-line from the power steering resevior had been hit by the serpentine belt.
That was all O.K.! As well as the serpentine belt.
So, two days later, and $425.00 I'm back on the road (a very wet, cold road), here in
"sunny" Southern California.
I'm still getting really bad gas mileage. I just knew that after the valve-job, my mileage
would get better, go up...
More/Later...Donald
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RE: O.K, here's waht I've done or had done! - 3/13/2008 8:59:23 AM
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GeoC
Posts: 10
Joined: 4/13/2007
Status: offline
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K & N filters do not filter air as well as paper filters. Stands to reason: if it increases flow by being less restrictive, well then it will not filter as well. I found this out myself on a trip across dirt roads in NM some years ago. Our group consisted of two 97 Discos, same mileage. I had just installed a new K & N, the other Disco was stock. After several days of very, very intense dust we checked our air systems. Mine had a fine powder coating all over the inside. The other was clean. I tried to discuss the situation with K & N but did not get anywhere. Bottom line: if you want the (additional?) power that comes with a more freeflowing intake and plan to stay out of dust the K & N is fine. If you want to be prepared for extreme off road conditions and want clean air entering your engine, stay with the more restrictive paper filter.
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